(too old to reply)
1970-01-01 00:00:00 UTC
<div><br></div><div>I think it should not be called a &quot;protocol for co=
mmunication among computers, sound synthesizers and other multimedia device=
s&quot; but a &quot;protocol for <b>simple one-way control</b>=A0among comp=
uters, sound synthesizers and other multimedia devices&quot;.<br>

</div><div><br></div><div>Once this is clarified, we stop wanting to bend O=
SC to do things it should not do.</div><div><br></div><div>For high level i=
nter-node communication I am using ZeroMQ with Msgpack and it is true that =
there is some complexity overhead with asynchronous bi-directional communic=
ation and we probably do not want to have this in a keyboard or continuum c=

<div><br></div><div>As for a query protocol, I think returning JSON or YAML=
with a full description of services would solve all my auto-querying needs=
.</div><div><br></div><div><font face=3D"courier new, monospace"><b>query</=
b>: /__osc/features &quot;</font><b style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier new&#=
39;,monospace">device id&quot;</b><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier n=
ew&#39;,monospace">=A0</span><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier new&#3=
9;,monospace">&quot;some.ip.for.reply&quot; [port]</span></div>

<div><font face=3D"courier new, monospace"><b>reply</b>: /__osc/reply =A0 =
=A0</font><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier new&#39;,monospace">&quot=
;</span><b style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier new&#39;,monospace">device id<=
/b><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier new&#39;,monospace">&quot;=A0</s=
pan><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier new&#39;,monospace">&quot;/feat=
ures&quot;</span><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier new&#39;,monospace=

<div><br></div><div>We cannot and should not use device IP for identificati=
on of reply, hence the <b>device id=A0</b>(representing the <b>queried devi=
ce from the sender&#39;s view</b>). For example, if osculator wanted to kno=
w what my image processing script has for control, it would first need to s=
ee me on the network (use Zeroconf or human configuration), give me an inte=
rnal name like &quot;dev01&quot; and then:</div>

<div><br></div><div><font face=3D"courier new, monospace"><b>osculator --&g=
t; lubyk:</b>=A0/__osc/features=A0</font><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;co=
urier new&#39;,monospace">&quot;dev01&quot;</span><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&#39;courier new&#39;,monospace">=A0&quot;; 7014</span></div= <div><font face=3D"courier new, monospace"><b>lubyk --&gt; osculator:</b>=
=A0/__osc/reply =A0 =A0</font><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;courier new&#=
39;,monospace">&quot;dev01&quot;=A0</span><span style=3D"font-family:&#39;c=
ourier new&#39;,monospace">&quot;/features&quot; JSON</span></div>

<div><br></div><div>Note that the reply is a single OSC address for all rep=
lies with the device id and queried url.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers,</=
div><div><br></div><div>Gaspard</div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div>

<div class=3D"h5"><br>
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Feb 4, 2014 at 3:27 AM, Adrian Freed=
<span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:***@cnmat.berkeley.edu" target=
=3D"_blank">***@cnmat.berkeley.edu</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote =
class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid=

Ahh, if only we were gods at CNMAT.<br>
We are actually relatively poor, pragmatists and we haven&#39;t built much =
around here<br>
that uses the query/reply design pattern. Personally speaking it rubs again=
st my reflex of using stateless protocols.<br>
That said I have never discouraged that sort of work for which OSC is a rea=
sonable encoding.<br>
I have seen several usable implementations of the pattern - at the Topologi=
cal Media Lab., for example.<br>
One of the more common uses of query/reply is device and service enumeratio=
n (sometimes called &quot;discovery&quot;). We<br>
will soon publish some code that does this in an interesting way for Blueto=
oth LE. It doesn&#39;t require changes to OSC and uses<br>
coroutines to avoid the complexities that often arise with query/reply stat=
e machines.<br>
On Feb 3, 2014, at 1:14 PM, Gaspard Bucher &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:***@te=
ti.ch" target=3D"_blank">***@teti.ch</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; A couple of people around osc_dev worked on implementing such an async=
hronous query/reply system back in 2009:<br>
&gt; <a href=3D"http://lubyk.org/en/software/oscit" target=3D"_blank">http:=
&gt; [rant]<br>
&gt; The thing worked fine but for a proper query/reply system to work, I h=
ad to implement more structure in replies and have been proposing to use Ha=
sh and List arguments in OSC for ages. I have a slightly modified oscpack v=
ersion that supports nested dictionaries and arbitrary lists. It&#39;s ligh=
tweight, fast, but it never got any traction from CNMAT (the gods of OSC) s=
o it&#39;s dead.<br>

&gt; [/rant]<br>
&gt; Whatever you do while designing such a system, my 2c would be to creat=
e real world use cases and implement them with different protocol ideas. It=
&#39;s very surprising how some solutions are *very* hard to implement and =
slight modifications become quite easy.<br>

&gt; Gaspard<br>
&gt; On Fri, Jan 31, 2014 at 2:58 PM, Ray Cutler &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ray@=
vidvox.net" target=3D"_blank">***@vidvox.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; Howdy-<br>
&gt; &quot;How does your effort relate to <a href=3D"http://opensoundcontro=
l.org/files/osc-query-system.pdf" target=3D"_blank">http://opensoundcontrol=
.org/files/osc-query-system.pdf</a> ?&quot;<br>
&gt; That&#39;s the doc that got me interested in this stuff, and the first=
link in the proposal! =A0Right now it&#39;s somewhere between the Schmeder=
/Wright pdf you linked to and OSNIP, which (as you noted) serves a similar =
purpose through slightly different means. =A0If you have preferences one wa=
y or the other please stop by and let us know- either open a new issue, or =
weigh in on some of the open ones. =A0This is definitely still very much op=
en for discussion!<br>

&gt; cheers<br>
&gt; : : ray<br>
&gt; _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; OSC_dev mailing list<br>
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&gt; --<br>
&gt; =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Gaspard<br>
&gt; _______________________________________________<br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div></div><=
/div><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888">-- <br><br><div>=A0=A0 =
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0=
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0 Gaspard</div>
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